Expectations

[CAM]

Generally, women think that men have low expectations of them (e.g., sex, big boobs, a hiking/vacation partner). Other than that, there is impression generated in the media that that men will settle for anything that copulates and not expect anything more.

Is this true or in your estimation, do you have higher expectations of women than most women think you have?

[misombra]

i would figure the opposite to be true. i think men have a high expectation of women based on what's in the media. women are always glammed up, thin, big boobies, and doing everything that a man would want a woman to do.

personally i have low expectations for everybody, man or woman.

[vashti]

Low expectations? :surprise:

I agree with misombra. I think men expect a lot. Not only are we supposed to eternally loook like we are 21 without an ounce of cellulite and with boobs that will defy gravity until we die despite having to endure pregnancy-related disfiguration, we are generally expected to cook, clean, raise perfect kids, have sex on demand (and love it, even if it sucks) and work outside the home. Seems like a lot to me.

Maybe things are different where you live, Cam.

[CAM]

i would figure the opposite to be true. i think men have a high expectation of women based on what's in the media. women are always glammed up, thin, big boobies, and doing everything that a man would want a woman to do.

personally i have low expectations for everybody, man or woman.

Glammed up but sort of just Barbie's At least out West (USA), women are sort of ornaments or pals or sex-buddies. Personally, I'd rather have less "glam" (since glam does not equal class or intellect) and have more "good woman"...a real person who takes pride in making a life with a guy.

Agreed...I have low expectations of everyone, too. It seems like the more affluent the society, the less normal the people.

[CAM]

Low expectations? :surprise:

I agree with misombra. I think men expect a lot. Not only are we supposed to eternally loook like we are 21 without an ounce of cellulite and with boobs that will defy gravity until we die despite having to endure pregnancy-related disfiguration, we are generally expected to cook, clean, raise perfect kids, have sex on demand (and love it, even if it sucks) and work outside the home. Seems like a lot to me.

Maybe things are different where you live, Cam.

Where I live (upper middle class America), women would run for the ****ing hills if they had to cook or clean or even raise their ****ing children. All they want to do is work outside the home so that they can get paid to shuffle paper in an office. All they want to do is hike/bike/travel.

So, here I am...I don't want sex on demand, I don't demand that the woman work outside the home, I DO WANT her to (with me) raise kids and maintain a home while I go ahead and pay for it through my work.

If you are class act, then believe me...I for one could give a darn if you age. That's life...we all age. But, staying in as good a shape as possible--for health reasons if nothing else--not becoming a slob...that's what I would like to see. I work on my physique for health, so I would want my partner to do the same. I think that's reasonable.

[CAM]

The big thing women will always resist...cooking, cleaning, raising kids, and staying at home. Believe me, those are the big reasons that women and men have different expectations. Most women love to escape the house and the responsibilities...at least in my neck of the woods.

[Junket]

I know I found a woman who isn't afraid to work. In fact she prefers physical labor over paper pushing. Good ethics this southern girl has.

[Converse]

Don't expect anything then you wont get let down.

[vashti]

The big thing women will always resist...cooking, cleaning, raising kids, and staying at home. Believe me, those are the big reasons that women and men have different expectations. Most women love to escape the house and the responsibilities...at least in my neck of the woods.

I don't think women "resist" these traditional responsibilities so much as they resent being asked to do these things in addition to working outside the home. We seem to have increased our responsibilites while men have a decreased level of financial responsibility yet often don't feel a need to help out more at home. (Stereotypes, of course.) I'm not blaming men, per se. I think women did this to themselves.

Anyway, I think times are changing. Lots of women are opting to raise their own kids where I live if they can afford to, and that means their men are stepping up to the plate. Of course, this may not be for the best, either. With divorce rates as high as they are, what will all these women without work experience do if their husbands decide to unload them?

[Gigabitch]

We seem to have increased our responsibilites while men have a decreased level of financial responsibility yet often don't feel a need to help out more at home.

This is the problem. Women working full-time to bring in money is considered normal, not "helping out", yet the household chores and childrearing are seen as the woman's responsibility and anything a man contributes is to be perceived as him doing her a great big favor, for which he expects to be praised loudly and held up as an example of a progressive and evolved human being.

CAM, I don't know what men expect of women, but I think that what women expect of themselves is almost impossible. I know I'm barely able to hold it together sometimes, and it's difficult for me to see what I should do.

Once again, I blame the media and the economic system based on limitless growth that is behind it. If we didn't all think we have to live in a 6-bedroom McMansion and drive a Hummer to be considered successful, maybe both parents could spend some more time at home, cooking dinner together and spending time with their kids.

Maybe if there weren't such a precedent of successful men dumping their wives for girls half their age, women would feel a little more secure about not developing themselves professionally. The society I want to live in would censure such an act, not uphold it as proof of virility.

Maybe if families looked at each other as much as they look at the TV, there would be a bit more cohesion. At this point, I'm aware of several marriages that are held together by nothing beyond shared debt.

Pretty bleak, ain't it?

[jurupa]

I don't think women "resist" these traditional responsibilities so much as they resent being asked to do these things in addition to working outside the home. We seem to have increased our responsibilites while men have a decreased level of financial responsibility yet often don't feel a need to help out more at home. (Stereotypes, of course.) I'm not blaming men, per se. I think women did this to themselves.

Its called the feminist movement. I think it did a lot of good back in the day, but now it is just hurting females in general.


The one thing I notice is that everyone is pointing for the most part the physical "expectations" men have. I think in reality most mens physical expectations are lower than most think here. The media just makes our physical expectations higher than they really are. Yes guys will flock and try and win over that hottie at the bar, but the reality of it is us men are really looking for a girl that meets our mating requirements. There has been studies on this where there was like some perfect ratio of hips to waist that men look for, and the girls that have this are more considered hot than the ones that don't.

But personally, I rather have a hot average looking girl that is smart than a smoking hot girl that is not that smart. And I would want my wife to take up the traditional roles women had, as it worked. I have no problem helping her out around the house if she worked as well.

[Converse]

It's all about balence.

[vashti]

I think in reality most mens physical expectations are lower than most think here.

I rather have a hot average looking girl that is smart than a smoking hot girl that is not that smart.

These two sentences conflict with one another. Both types of girls you mention as options include the word "hot". You have just proven our point, silly.

I have no problem helping her out around the house if she worked as well.

I know it is a matter of semantics, but you must have missed Giga's point. It shouldn't be that men are "helping" women by participating in routine home care, because that implies the responsibility is really HERS and he is just being a good guy by "helping out". The responsibility is shared. You would never see a woman say "I am a great woman because I help out with the household chores".

[Gigabitch]

You would never see a woman say "I am a great woman because I help out with the household chores".

How about, "I help out with the mortgage."?

[vashti]

...or "I help out by bathing the kids and putting them to bed".