Problems cause by religion

[doppelgaenger]

I am basically an atheist... but I went to Wartburg today. Look it up if you don't know what that is.

I find the bible interesting, in the historical aspect. It was very interesting to see 475 year old copies of the bible, hand written and printed as well, before language standardizations and reformations.

[bluesummer]

Ygg, The same way they didn't respond to my post,they don't respond to Yours. They all are just stupid and prefere to talk about the thing where nobody has a right, or lets say, we won't know till we die Actually we have all the right to report this thread

YEAH We have, cause yesterday moderator deleted post by Sonrisa,where actually she did nothing wrong,and here they are BREAKING the rules of LF and nobody takes care? Pfff .It's like ,the rules are just for part of people?

First of all, no one here is stupid simply because you don't like what they have to say.

Secondly, all of us regulars are well aware of the rules of LF. This is also one of the rare occasions that a religious thread has not been gone crazily inflammatory. Report us if you will, but it achieves nothing.

That's the last I want to hear about it from your end, you're the only one complaining. Just stop coming into this thread if you don't like it.

[Petit Papillon]

First of all, no one here is stupid simply because you don't like what they have to say.

Secondly, all of us regulars are well aware of the rules of LF. This is also one of the rare occasions that a religious thread has not been gone crazily inflammatory. Report us if you will, but it achieves nothing.

That's the last I want to hear about it from your end, you're the only one complaining. Just stop coming into this thread if you don't like it.

Can't You set Your nose higher madamme?

[Doc Durian]

Religion is sufficiently boring enough for the majority these days that apathy sets in and we tune out just as we pretend to not hear the door bell ring or the flash of black and white suits through the curtains preceding it.

I'm not fussed about this thread one way or another. I said my piece... George Carlin is my god... He's wise, dead, and he had a wicked sense of humour.

Of course, Joe Pesci was his...

[IndiReloaded]

They charge for the entrance? Looks like a money making scheme by a couple of opportunists trying to make a quick buck on people's fears.

It's hard to say "they" in these types of situations. Who are they? As you know Religious community itself is greatly divided on a lot of issues, the gradient stretches all the way from open to new ideas to completely closed. Maybe it would be more productive not to attack Religion or Religious people as a whole, but just the ones who are completely entrenched in their silly conservative ideas? (Like the Pope and his ban on condoms in Africa)

I don't think I've attacked anyone, Mish. All I am pointing out is that at least some religious folk are offended/scared at the idea that 'atheists' are likewise prepared to go out and advertise their beliefs. I mean, those two young men were quite prepared to sell me their religion. What they weren't prepared for was that I was an equally skilled salesperson on the benefits of atheism.

So, why ever should they be offended? Why should those who do door-to-door religious campaining have a monopoly on knocking on people's doors and stating their version of 'truth'?

The answer is: they don't. So, I say, let everyone have at it, and the belief system with the best argument win.

Gribble: I tried to find an 'Atheist Brochure' on the web and failed. Want to write one as a project? Your blog will be guaranteed to have a ton of hits.

[Mish]

So, why ever should they be offended? Why should those who do door-to-door religious campaining have a monopoly on knocking on people's doors and stating their version of 'truth'?

The answer is: they don't. So, I say, let everyone have at it, and the belief system with the best argument win.

By all means. Though I hope it's not going to turn into a penis size competition where the one who can trash the "opposition" the most wins. There is room for both to coexist. Actually, both have to find a way to co-exist because there will not be an absolute victory for either side.

[Yggdrasil]

No one cares about this particular rule besides you two. If you don't want to talk about religion, ignore this thread and stop banging your head against the wall.

Hey, leave me out of it and read my post again. I have no problem with the rules. Those are up to the mods.

My concern is that the thread has grown beyond the original question.

[IndiReloaded]

I always looked forward to their little 'interventions' because they amused me greatly. They always started off so animated, and in the end walked away so perplexed why things didn't 'go their way'.

Because, Blue, they weren't looking for a 'believer', they were looking for a NEW MEMBER. If they weren't they would have left you alone at 'I think there's a god, but I don't go to church'.

Think about this: if you DO state a belief in God, what comes next? A questioning about your form of worship and where. I know, b/c I've done this experiment also.

So, I can only conclude these fellows are using people's belief in God to further their own human interests. Think about what that really means.

Just as a unrelated highlight, with so many different opinions and all claiming to be "right", doesn't that mean that regardless of whether there's a god or not very many will be incorrect? It doesn't exactly strengthen the case that religion is making.

Well, it means that we need to be thinking about this more, I think.

I mean, think about all the kafuffle when Galileo challenged the geocentric view of the world.

More thinking, more discussion = great change. It took a while, and it was painful for a lot of people (including Galileo), but in the end progress was made.

I put humanity's reliance on organized religion in the same type of category. We are outgrowing the need for it as a guiding force in our lives. There are many good, moral people out there who do not need religion to force them to do what is right.

Churches stand to lose lots if people decide that they don't need an organization to tell them how they should be growing, spiritually. If that isn't a case for conflict of interest, I don't know what is.

So, discuss & argue away. Its the only way that change happens.

I also KNOW that this capacity for spiritual growth can be corrupted by people who are using religion to control and manipulate the masses.

I agree with this^. Which is why I think religion, as a life option, should only be made available after children have reached an age where they can reason for themselves. Critical thinking first, then religion, should they choose it.

When it comes to religion, I respect any religion, be that muslim, christian, wiccan, budhism,... as long as the intend is to grow in a spiritual way. The moment religion is used to corrupt, manipulate, abuse and destroy, I will raise my voice and speak up.

Ditto^. Unfortunately, I put exposing one's young children to religion into the 'manipulate' category.

[bluesummer]

Can't You set Your nose higher madamme?

That made no sense whatsoever, but nice try.

My point, since you obviously missed it, is that as long as things stay under control, there's no reason we can't discuss something. When people start getting hateful, that's when we're no longer being productive in our discussion. Usually, the mods will let us do our thing if we're 'good'.

[Yggdrasil]

Which is why I think religion, as a life option, should only be made available after children have reached an age where they can reason for themselves. Critical thinking first, then religion, should they choose it. Unfortunately, I put exposing one's young children to religion into the 'manipulate' category.

I totaly agree that the choice should be made by the individual, at a "ripe" age.

Thx for bringing that up. Somehow, eventhough I wanted to mention that in my post, I didn't.

Forced religion frequently kills spirituality.

True spirituality comes from the inside and can not be forced. One 'grows' into it.

True spirituality seldon has much to do with relgion, rather, religion becomes an expression of ones spirituality.

[Doc Durian]

My gag reflex is starting.

I'm out.

[Yggdrasil]

My gag reflex is starting. I'm out.

You need a bag?

_____________

[Doc Durian]

Nahh, just a bit of religion free air...

[Lostalien]

Dude why don't u stfu and go away. I have the rights to have opinions too, ok?

Ygg, The same way they didn't respond to my post,they don't respond to Yours. They all are just stupid and prefere to talk about the thing where nobody has a right, or lets say, we won't know till we die Actually we have all the right to report this thread

YEAH We have, cause yesterday moderator deleted post by Sonrisa,where actually she did nothing wrong,and here they are BREAKING the rules of LF and nobody takes care? Pfff .It's like ,the rules are just for part of people?

[Doc Durian]

Dude why don't u stfu and go away. I have the rights to have opinions too, ok?

No need for that.

I'm out of the convo and had just replied to Yggdrasil out of politeness.

Do what makes you happy.