would you stay or would you go?

[searock]

The red flag in your case is the length of the relationship and the the fact he doesn't put you on the same level as his ex (she was 'true love').

This is true, but the thing is, she was his first love. It was his first relationship, it started when he was 17, I mean, he was still a kid. They didn't even have sex until they were almost 19, and even after that they would do it like once every 2 months or something. It was a kid's relationship basically. Whenever the issue comes up in a conversation (which isn't at all frequent), he always says that it was different with her because he was so young and it was his first time for everything. Which means that he still believed in "fairy tales" so to speak (his words), he let himself go completely, he didn't keep his guard up at all. I kind of get what he means - the feelings I had for the first guy I fell in love with, back when I was 14-15, were a lot more intense and violent. Obviously I feel nothing for the guy right now, but the memory of what I felt for him at the time will never truly leave me. At least, that's what I think right now, 7 years later... for my bf it's only an year later, so I can understand. This also has an impact on his unwillingness to "let himself go" with me, he is still a bit traumatized from what happened. I had years to recover, he had just one for now (even though he's done TONS of progress already). If it hadn't been his first relationship... I don't think I could've stood it.

[vashti]

you may both come to appreciate that what you have right now is special and worth keeping. Or maybe you will both learn the hard way after an unnecessary breakup.

I agree that he may look back at some point and regret he let a good thing go (if she were to leave him), but it seems that unless she leaves, he isn't ever going to understand that.

[VincenzoG91]

I agree that he may look back at some point and regret he let a good thing go (if she were to leave him), but it seems that unless she leaves, he isn't ever going to understand that.

You changed my mind about this situation. I think this guy is a fool, and the only way that he is going to appreciate this relationship fully is after it's over.

[searock]

Why do you think so, Vashti and Vincenzo?

[Cerulean.]

Honestly, I agree with Vashti and Vincenzo. Look what happened to me, searock. Again... your bf sounds like me. I was 17 when I first dated my first love... we didn't have sex until 19... he was my first for everything (except kiss) and after we broke up, I was too chicken sh*t to let myself go in my next relationship with my best friend. Felt that since my ex was my first for everything (best friend had sex before etc) that it was more "intimate" and "special" and that I should try to hold on to that. Biggest mistake, ever. Even though I had more of a connection with my best friend and he fulfilled a lot more both in bed and boyfriend material wise, I still couldn't let go of what I had with my ex. Now, here I am still just friends with my best friend and he's moved on.

Not to get you down again... who knows. Your boyfriend might be different. Either way, I have a feeling he's going to regret letting you go.

[searock]

I understand, Cerulean... I do hope he's different, but unfortunately I can totally see your point, and relate him to you.

How did it go for you, did you realize that you were actually *in love* with your best friend when you broke up? Or did you just realize that he was a better match for you?

[Cerulean.]

Thing is, I KNEW I was in love, and we had expressed our love to one another. The thing that was stopping me was making him and I official. We were together and in love, just without the title because of how "afraid" I was to move on completely.

Again, I don't know your boyfriend and what's going on in his head, but he's still young. You both are. You're his SECOND relationship. I'd still continue being patient with him and enjoying your time with him. If lots of time has past and you're still bummed about him not saying "I love you" or that he finds true love with you, then you gotta do what makes you most happy. Maybe you should start to think to let him go so you can find someone who gives you the whole package. Or, maybe you break it off and he'll realize his mistakes and immediately come back to you and tell you he loves you. Either way, just enjoy being with him right now. Still be 100% you and love him.

[vashti]

Why do you think so, Vashti and Vincenzo?

Listen, late last night, I heard the screen door swing,
And a big yellow taxi took my girl away
Now don't it always seem to go
That you don't know what you got till it's gone
They paved paradise and put up a parking lot

[url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FdLEdkiXm9c[/url]

[toknow]

searock, you might be still young but it's good that you are thinking about this now. Because before you blink, you'll be 30.

I'd say, keep on searching, but that only you can decide. True love is rare, and for some people is the only way, they wouldn't feel comfortable in a usual relationship. Because they know deep down, as if they were made for it, that nothing else will come close to it.

Seek and you shall find, ask and you shall be given.

If true love is all you've wanted all your life, you will find it. But, if every now and then you wonder if it would be nice to have it, I doubt that will be enough.

[searock]

Update: we talked today. He said that while he can't imagine being with me in 20 years time - because he doesn't want to imagine any future at all, since he did that a lot with his ex gf and it didn't end well, so he is traumatized and doesn't want to do it again - and he doesn't think mushy stuff such as "we are soul mates", he believes that what he feels for me is "a form of love". I asked him if he really thinks so, and if he thinks it is "true love" (we have talked about a definition of "true love" before, so he knew what I meant). He replied that yes, he thinks it is true love, because he wouldn't behave as he does with me (for example: tonight he brought me a surprise dinner, including strawberries and ice cream), if it were only love like that for a sister or a close friend. Fair enough.

The way I see it, he is still traumatized by the negative experience with his first girlfriend. I have discussed this with a mutual friend of ours, and she also thinks this is the case. He can't let himself entirely go, because he is still keeping his guard up due to his past. He has made enormous progress though - for example: the first months we were dating, even though we were already extremely close since we had been having an emotional relationship for an year and a half, and before that we were already best friends, he still didn't want to make it official. We were exclusive of course, he just wasn't comfortable with us being "boyfriend and girlfriend". He said that, in general, in order to use those terms, he needs to be 100% sure of what he feels for the girl in question (me, in that case). Now it's been months since we've started calling each other boyfriend and girlfriend, and today in particular he explicitly referred to himself as "your boyfriend" (talking to me of course), as if to reinforce the fact that I have really nothing to worry about.

So basically the whole problem is that he is still suffering from his first heart break. I know that such an experience can be devastating, I've experienced it too of course, but as I said it was 7 years ago, so I had more than enough time to recover.

Now, the only thing I'm worried about, even though it is not of immediate concern, is that even when he finally gets completely over his trauma (and as I said he has made incredible progress up till now, so he's definitely on the right track), he will always associate me with it.

Right now, when we talk about our feelings (and this does NOT happen frequently at all), the ghost of his ex girlfriend never fails to haunt us. I told him today that I don't care if he doesn't feel the same for me than he did for her, I just care that he is in love with me, that's all (that's when he said that thing about the "form of love" etc). I really hope he gets it. I am sick of being compared to that part of his life.

toknow, thank you for your advice. I agree with you, I think that right now, I want to be in a relationship bounded by "true love". So I hope that I am doing the right thing by staying with him, based on what he said today and on the way he behaves in general. Time will tell.

[toknow]

It's very normal for him to react this way after a break up. Because when someone tells you they are your soul mate and then they leave you, when he's heard all these words that in the end have ended up meaning nothing, it's quite normal for him to not believe them when he hears them again. You have to show him that this is different. he doesn't believe in words now, he believes in actions. There are many things you can do to show him your love and that it's nothing like what he had with his ex. You have to show him some selfless, unconditional love. Don't expect any reaction in return, just show him your love without expecting anything, and once he sees this he will come around if he has it in him. There is just no way for him not to respond, love responds and gravitates towards love. If he doesn't have it in him he will not respond. Just give him time, he is right to be cautious.

[pisces25]

Now, the only thing I'm worried about, even though it is not of immediate concern, is that even when he finally gets completely over his trauma (and as I said he has made incredible progress up till now, so he's definitely on the right track), he will always associate me with it.

You're already thinking of the next thing to worry bout!!! Why are you sabotaging this relationship? I could be way off here but it seems that you know you're not entirely happy in this r/ship and want to leave but don't have a legitimate reason because he treats you so well so you are finding reasons to end it. This ex is always going to haunt you in one form or another. Until you get past that you will remain unfulfilled.

[vashti]

For how long has he been clinging to memories of his ex?

[searock]

It's very normal for him to react this way after a break up. Because when someone tells you they are your soul mate and then they leave you, when he's heard all these words that in the end have ended up meaning nothing, it's quite normal for him to not believe them when he hears them again. You have to show him that this is different. he doesn't believe in words now, he believes in actions. There are many things you can do to show him your love and that it's nothing like what he had with his ex. You have to show him some selfless, unconditional love. Don't expect any reaction in return, just show him your love without expecting anything, and once he sees this he will come around if he has it in him. There is just no way for him not to respond, love responds and gravitates towards love. If he doesn't have it in him he will not respond. Just give him time, he is right to be cautious.

He was the one to break up with his ex. But she brought him to it, she treated him like sh*t for the last 2.5 years. What killed the relationship was long distance and their inexperience, both emotional and sexual. I don't think that he doesn't believe I think that we are soulmates, he just isn't comfortable with the idea, because he used to have that type of "eternal unconditional love" with his ex and it brought him a lot of pain, so he just doesn't want to let himself go to it again. So for all I know, if it weren't for his past he would love me like that, but until he gets over it I'll never know. But I'm OK with this "form of love" as he says - considered, it is a lot :-).

You're already thinking of the next thing to worry bout!!! Why are you sabotaging this relationship?

Hehe yeah, I though about it when I wrote it. Well it's not that I am unsatisfied with the relationship, it's just my personality, to worry about things. Also, my bf and I have a long past of broken promises and heart break (on my side). So I find it particularly difficult to just trust that it will be OK in the end, that he truly loves me and that I have nothing to worry about. When we weren't together yet but we had the emotional relationship (and he was still with his ex, which he just wouldn't leave in spite of the fact the relationship made him extremely miserable, all in the name of "eternal, unconditional love"), he would treat me like a princess, like he was completely smitten over me, everyone could see that, and he would tell me "I am going to break up soon, I can't stop thinking about you" and then, he would NEVER do it. This happened periodically every 3-4 months or something, during a total period of 1.5 years. It was an emotional roller coaster that put me through extreme pain. So yeah, he has a past with his ex, I have a past with him, ironically. My faith in our relationship and our love has always made me believe that we will get over all the adversities in the end. But I still worry a lot, especially when we talk about feelings and he doesn't seem to reciprocate mine (as it seemed before yesterday).

This ex is always going to haunt you in one form or another. Until you get past that you will remain unfulfilled.

So... does this mean that whenever we talk about our feelings, the conversation will always somehow involve her? :-( !

For how long has he been clinging to memories of his ex?

He broke up with her for good after three months we started dating (I know, wrong, but I know him very well and it just wouldn't have happened otherwise. He is very frail, emotionally), so that makes it less than an year (it will be an year in September) since their break up, and they were together for almost 5 years (event though the last 3 years were long distance, and sh*tty). Considering his personality, I don't find it strange at all that he still thinks of her sometimes (it happens less and less every month that goes by, and in a more and more detached way). He is extremely nostalgic by nature.

[toknow]

"He was the one to break up with his ex. But she brought him to it, she treated him like sh*t for the last 2.5 years"

He is the one who signed the divorce paper so to speak, but she is the one who ended it, because by treating him like that, she showed she didn't love him. If she doesn't love him, whether she is around or not, that's not a relationship.